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07-02-2001, 03:26 PM
One of these days when i was programming and losing, as a usually do, a lot of hours of my life http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/smile.gif i cant kept thinking about this tought that suddenfly came to me : I mean, i know computer stuff and informatic world in general is mainly a male world, that has a very small( or none) impact in womens/girls. Well im not talking about gaming or just playing with the computer, or something, but as we are in a forum about programming, in a specific matter about OpenGL, i wonder... what do you all think about so few girls/womens are actracted to programming? Do you actually know , for instance, any girls/women of your age that is really interested on programming, maybe
in Opengl programming? I think , spite is a non-OpenGL related matter, is a very interesting thing to discuss...if your brains arent yet all fu***d up by standing to many hours in front of a computer http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/biggrin.gif

Morglum
07-02-2001, 10:41 PM
Well I think you are not the only one to have
noticed the lack of interrest of girls in
programming http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/frown.gif.
But continue hoping http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/wink.gif ! One day girls shall
understand their mistake and plenty of them
shall come to programming and you shall not
believe your eyes http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/eek.gif ! I predict that !

john
07-02-2001, 10:45 PM
Howdy,

we have a fair number of girls in first year... but they all drop out by second year. =(

cheers,
John

07-02-2001, 11:36 PM
there was an interesting article about chick programmers in a demo scene related article some time back. By no means are grrrls on a even count with male programmers but they are out there and numbers are getting bigger all the time.

JoeMac
07-03-2001, 06:41 AM
Hopefully the number of women in this field will continue to grow in spite of comments such as 'chick programmers'.
Joe

jankri
07-03-2001, 08:32 AM
Interesting topic...

Well I am one of those few and far between "chick programmers" as you say it..... Actually in my program there are 4 girls out of 33 programmers in the class (note that the four of us girls are all at or near the top of the class in CS)... this summer I am working in a university graphics research lab that is almost half women.

evil
07-03-2001, 10:18 PM
4 ! :gasp:
I knew female programmers existed, but I've never actually seen one. Could you post a picture ? <g>

07-04-2001, 01:48 AM
Hi,

http://mermaid.c64scene.org

I don't know if I'm granted to post this link here. Anyway you'll find a cute girl, who is obsessed to the demoscene and Amigas. She's even writing games. For the C64!

mmmh...maybe that is a clue, too (a very sweet, i belive)
http://www.jinxhackwear.com/gallery.asp

Maybe someone, who has some sparetime, does an extensive search on female computer entities. I saw a site once, which listed all chicks who are related to coding. Damn I lost the link.

Bye,
Daniel

mochi
07-04-2001, 05:49 AM
Hi ...
i'm a female programmer ... and there are lots more where i came from. and the number is growing ... =>

07-04-2001, 08:44 AM
Q.: Whay are there so few women programmers?

A.: Programming is based on something that women struggle to comprehend... logic.

harsman
07-04-2001, 11:16 AM
Of the under grads studying comp. science at the university I go too, about 40% are women (in my year/class). It's much less for the engineers though.

indie_dev
07-06-2001, 01:40 AM
I've programmed for engineering firms and for IT departments (i.e. business programming - Java, XML, Oracle,etc.). There is a much higher percentage of women in IT than in engineering, for what that's worth.

To the original poster: I apologize if you're new to this country (I can't tell by your name), but work on your English skills. You'll go a lot farther in this field -- or in any field -- if you can communicate clearly.

jg

Zeus_666
07-06-2001, 04:27 AM
Hi,
I have just finished my first year of my computing degree, there is one girl on my course, there were three girls on my a'level course. I think there should be more.

07-06-2001, 04:56 AM
I believe, the reason why I met so few female programmers (in fact: only one), are generally my communication skills and my fear of girls and their secret powers. I'm working in a mediapark in germany. Many companys have settled here, but all the girls are related to graphics and print, but not really to coding. However, I don't mind to loose hope. I know that they are out there, those cutes, who aren't attracted to makeup, shopping and party, at all.

G4Soon
07-06-2001, 10:38 AM
I really wish there was a female programmer in my life.

in fact, I haven't had a sustainable girlfriend, ever, due to the simple fact that they don't understand what makes me tick.

"What is SO interesting about programming, John? Why do you spend every second you're not with me on your computer?"

geeze... you'd think the answer would be obvious...

Is it so hard for women to program? what is it, in their general personality, that does not normally produce the programmer mentality?

An Naoscaire: ouch! logic has little to do with it. Granted, it is a necessary skill for a programmer, but all the women and young ladies I know are extremely logical, and programming doesn't appeal to them at all.

Mochi: ah, a breath of fresh air. And thank you for the heads up on that "growing number" thing - I'll keep my eyes peeled for 'em.


here's a quick limerick I wrote on the subject:

There once was a young lad from North Bay,
Who'd been yearning to stand up and say:
"Good lord, how I've missed
a chick programmer's kiss
that would send me six ways from sunday."


Sorry for the long post, but we (us guys, mainly...) really do need some more female programmer's in the field. yarrr.

sorry to dump on you guys.

Tron
07-06-2001, 11:21 AM
i must confess i've never seen a female programmer in RL, i'm quite disappointed about this fact
at least mochi's post gives me a little hope, i'll keep searching (;

at my university (which is btw the most famous in computer science in my country) even in the first year there weren't that many girls and the numbers drop quite rapidly in the higher courses... ):

there really seems to be some difference in the 'nature' of male and females, which make these "boy's things", like programming, less ... yeah ... appealing to girls


@G4Soon:
your limerick reminds me of one i like:
there once was a young lady of wight,
who travelled much faster than light.
she departed one day
in a relative way
an arrived in the previous night.

but that's even more OT in this OT-topic (;

ET3D
07-06-2001, 12:04 PM
There were quite a few girl undergrads when I studied (finished BSc 6 years ago), and there continue to be a lot of them these days. And contrary to popular belief, many of them are really good looking.

But for some reason, I found that in the workplaces, the men outnumber the women by a lot. So where do all those cute programmers go? http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/smile.gif

JLawson
07-07-2001, 11:41 AM
WELL LETS JUST SAY US GUYS ARE USED TO USING JOYSTICKS =)

G4Soon
07-07-2001, 06:18 PM
ewwww.

phanie
07-09-2001, 04:18 AM
hi !
you've just made a mistake : there are a few number of female programmers + one : me !

big kisses for all males programmers

NewbieBen
07-09-2001, 09:51 AM
Hey everyone,
On my MSc course, there were about 5 women studying software engineering with me. Out of those, one dropped out to have a kid, and the other 4 arent actually interested in working in the industry!!

WHY?

Also, i hope these ladies that are into programming, are also into makeup and other girlie stuff! The 2 dont have to be mutually exclusive!!

G4Soon
07-09-2001, 12:34 PM
Phanie: Yes! the number is increasing! Excellent. One more breath of fresh air...


one more point - I've never really thought about this - but do any of you guys out there have stereotypes about lady programmers?

alternately, do any of you lady programmers out there feel like us guys are pushing stereotypes on you that you would like to clear up? Tell us about yourselves.

Zadkiel
07-09-2001, 01:11 PM
Noone sensible would ever consider sterotypes, they're non-existent creations used to make it easier to describe large group of people, not individuals.

G4Soon
07-09-2001, 02:46 PM
Zadkiel: Correction, no one SHOULD use stereotypes... I am aware of them, and thus they work their way into my life and conversational patterns on their own.

I absolutely HATE to apply stereotypes to life - that's why I like to find out what they are, and try to consciously fight against them.


ooh, I like these smilies...
http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/confused.gif ... http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/smile.gif ... http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/cool.gif

Rob The Bloke
07-09-2001, 03:53 PM
Two of my sister's are programmers and I've just finished a course where 25% were females. All of the girls on the course were very competant programmers, however I feel that they tended to lack confidence in their own abilities, believing instead, that they weren't as good as their male counterparts. I must admit though, that as much as I hate to say it, there are still men that I've come across that are suprised to see females programming; quite often they do make patronising remarks, which must be very off putting to someone who's trying to learn. My experiance of some lecturers has been that they often are less than helpful when females ask questions.....

07-12-2001, 02:28 PM
indie_dev:

"To the original poster: I apologize if you're new to this country (I can't tell by your name), but work on your English skills. You'll go a lot farther in this field -- or in any field -- if you can communicate clearly"

The american people are the most fu***ng egocentric people in the world, thats for sure! http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/mad.gif
Why do you say that i am new to this country?
is America the only place in the world that have acess to Internet? why cant i be in another country? Stop thinking America is the center of the world! Living in a country where the English is not the language people spoke, i have no responsibility on talking English like a English or an American citizen. Dont be offended with my words, it is not what i pretend, its just that the World is not only USA!
By the way, I live in Portugal, Europe. ( no Portugal dont belong to Spain , is a independent country for more than 800 years!)
P.S. -> Desculpa l a linguagem, p! ( Oh what is that http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/biggrin.gif

Platinum
07-12-2001, 10:10 PM
http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/smile.gif http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/frown.gif http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/redface.gif http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/wink.gif http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/tongue.gif http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/cool.gif http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/rolleyes.gif http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/mad.gif http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/eek.gif http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/confused.gif
(sorry, I just couldn' help myself, I love the smilies)
by the way, I agree that USA is not the centre of the world. I got already used to the fact, when I say where I am from (Czech Republic), people ask "where is it?", because we are as small as..., actualy 10mil. inh.. So, we are the eastern neighbour of Germany, and we DON'T speak english. Nor german. Unless you take lessons at school. So people, PLEEEEASE be patient with us, non-english speaking countries, our moms didn't teach us english in a cradle, we had to do it ourselves, and it is a HARD work, many years of studying.(7 in my case). But try to learn Japanese (I do), and try to WRITE in it, and you will know, what does it mean to study a language.

And back to the topic. I know only one girl, who does programming, but she does it not because she likes it, but because programmers are mostly boys(I hope you understand, what I want to say). I would appreciate more girls "between us".

To girls: GO FOR IT, DON' STOP, YOU CAN DO IT!

RedZen
07-12-2001, 11:16 PM
Well I would like to have a programming GF.
So all you girlie progie's, mail me!! And we can code the whole night through, hehehehehe.
Just kidding. http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/smile.gif

delsydsoft
07-13-2001, 06:22 AM
to _BaD_ReLiGiOn_ and Platinum:
I completely agree that too many Americans are egocentric self-centered bastards,and I live in the US. I could understand it if your posts were completely unreadable,but I had no problem reading them. I'm glad that you guys mentioned this,because I was about to complain about the same issue. http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/wink.gif

As far as Chick Programmers go,I like the idea of more women programming,but I don't think that I would want to have a relationship with one. Instead of fighting about money,housecleaning,etc, you would fight about the pros and cons of vertex arrays, proper form in c code,etc. I hate to think about that... http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/smile.gif

07-13-2001, 07:21 AM
http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/smile.gif http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/wink.gif http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/biggrin.gif


Live to Code..Code to Live..

Write code in your 2hrs of Sleep a night.

Live it.
Breath It.
Dream It.


Just what ever you do Just dont marry it.. http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/wink.gif


think of getting in a fight because you de-refed a pointer.. and caused the system to crash..
Do you think you would ever here the end of it??

The Car would break down and it would be your fault because you messed up that pointer.. etc..


Noooo, she would make sure it was the last thing you heard before you died..

Thats why I married a woman who teaches anger management to prisoners.

I figured it would be safer.. http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/smile.gif

http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/smile.gif

JLawson
07-13-2001, 08:09 AM
GUYS!! WHO GIVES A ****!! If you can read or generally make out what they are trying to say, let them be! At least they're being nice to you and trying to communicate in YOUR language. I've got about 9 friends who speak german, and all are programmers. I cant understand a damn thing that they say, maybe a few "Ach du scheie! Ich hab keine power!" or something like that.
The point being, Give them credit you stupid ****s! They're being nice enough to communicate in YOUR language, so they deserve respect.
Heres an Idea to all of you who oppose non-english-fluent people: Why dont YOU get off your lazy ass and learn THEIR language.
http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/smile.gif anyway, later all...

lgrosshennig
07-14-2001, 10:56 AM
Looks like some people still do not know what the Internet is all about http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/tongue.gif

My two cents.

LG http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/biggrin.gif

Quote of the day:
-----------------
"Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity."
--- Martin Luther King, Jr. (1929-68) ---

Tim Stirling
07-15-2001, 01:22 AM
One thing I find interesting and irritating is when foreign poeple think that all British people are also all English. I am British, a UK citizen but I am not English- I am Scottish, a Scot, Scotch ... - I wear a kilt, eat porridge, play the bagpipes and watch Braveheart endlessly (maybe not). Scotland isn't part of England it is a seperate country just like Canada isn't part of the USA! This is mostly results from ignorance, that is foregivable but, for example I sent a letter to France in perfect french, typed so there was no problem with reading it yet the return was something like:

my address
Scotland
Angleterre

??? This was interesting.

MarsuGL
07-15-2001, 11:16 AM
hello,
during my computer studies,
i have seen a few girls in my classroom and i don't think that any of them really like that they were doing there http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/frown.gif(

but i have had a teacher which was liking oop and OMT/UML methods,
i have just noticied that she was more looking like a men in appearence (basket,jeans, etc... dirt clothes,junk food behind the computer) but semmed to me to be as enjoying computer than a men http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/smile.gif
D.L

indie_dev
07-16-2001, 01:23 AM
Who said I was from the U.S.?

jg

lgrosshennig
07-16-2001, 05:25 PM
@Indy

1st.) the time of your posts...
2nd.) Your profile says...

Westerville, Oh, USA

is that right or wrong?

LG http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/biggrin.gif

Michael Steinberg
07-17-2001, 12:09 PM
Hey guys...
I think some of you have got serious problems. What's so attracting at girl programmers? Does every teaching men have a teacher as girlfriend?
I just think that you're so into programming (all the time... through nights) that you can't score with girls anymore! (This just applies to the guys which are so horny here)
As male hair-dressers may be gay (it's a prejudice at least here in germany), femal programmers are lesbian! http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/smile.gif Well it's just the society which makes the girls do other things as it does with men in other areas.
To the language part. We're on an english board, and for sure we need a language we can agree on. So we all should try to write good english. I do my best and meanwhile apologize for my english. My bits... Hope nobody hates me now... I ain't gots no enemies so far (Isn't that good english???)!

07-18-2001, 12:17 AM
Originally posted by mochi:
Hi ...
i'm a female programmer ... and there are lots more where i came from. and the number is growing ... =>

Where are you from?
Could you post a picture ?

B.

bsperlin
07-18-2001, 05:04 AM
1) My wife and I were introduced in 1971 by a female programmer. My wife hates computers and, to this day, won't go near one. That's OK with me. When I want to talk shop I'll talk to another programmer; when I want to talk about and do other things, my wife is there. Things have worked out fine.
2) I taught Computer Science for many years and the people who did the best were the ones who spent a lot of their own time programming. Surprise, Surprise! Students who do the best in Creative Writing spend a lot of their own time writing. Jock stars spend a lot of thier own time in the gym. I suspect that there is a mix of genetics and sociology at work when girls don't spend a lot of their own time on their home computer. This is a LONG topic.
3) Languages are designed to allow people to communicate ideas. We all need to use a single language so we can all communicate about OpenGL easily. English came up by default and we should all strive to communicate it clearly. Doesn't matter where you live.
Barry

UnImPortant
07-18-2001, 12:01 PM
'I just think that you're so into programming (all the time... through nights) that you can't score with girls anymore!'

Think about it the other way around, there sure are a lot of people (those guys that spend every off minute in front of their computers) who are into programming, because they simply can't get along with other people...

G4Soon
07-18-2001, 12:35 PM
I think I'd like a programmer for a girlfriend because I have so few people who I can talk to about programming.

If I've made an impressive project, something new that I've never done before or something that involoves a complex algorithm that I figured out, I have no one to talk to it about.

I can't explain what I'm doing to most of my friends... I can only show the end result. and while my work may be outwardly complimented, it's not fully and thoroughly understood and appreciated.

07-19-2001, 09:48 AM
Originally posted by delsydsoft:
to _BaD_ReLiGiOn_ and Platinum:

As far as Chick Programmers go,I like the idea of more women programming,but I don't think that I would want to have a relationship with one. Instead of fighting about money,housecleaning,etc, you would fight about the pros and cons of vertex arrays, proper form in c code,etc. I hate to think about that... http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards/ubb/smile.gif

Haha, as a female programmer who has lived with a male programmer for 5 years, I can tell you that this really does happen! I couldn't imagine being with someone who wasn't into all of the things that I am.. what would there be to talk about?

mc_hamming.

PS. my CS classes are ~40% female but very few of the women in the class ask questions or pester the professor when they don't understand something. That's a shame.

glGirl
07-24-2001, 10:59 AM
In my opinion girls and guys brains ARE wired differently. That doesn't make me a bad coder... I just go about it a different way.

VladR
07-26-2001, 03:08 AM
G4Soon :That is exactly the point. When my wife comes to me when I am sitting in front of the PC (as always) she just says :"Oh man, not again, still programming. How can You type and think in such an abstract way." When I want to talk about programming there is only a forum like this.

mc_hamming: I agree with You. In fact there is not much to talk about other than what interests her because she does not understand a damn thing about programming and also cannot understand how can I spend 9 hours in regular work and then I can spend another 5-7 hours till 01.00 am sitting behind the computer and "just typing some hieroglyphes".
I cannot imagine how great and inspirative it could be to talk with someone in my house about my current problem in programming. We both could find new ways and solutions. Even though I have to admit that we could argue about whose algo is better. But it could be fun , or not ?
In fact I tried to learn my girlfriend to program. She understands several commands but she cannot solve problems with her own ideas `cause she doesn`t have any.

As for the LANGUAGE problem, I am also not an native English speaker, and our company has been bought by another US company and all of US head managers have to admit that they admire us that we can learn to speak in other language than the one we started to hear from our cradle.

Also please tell me. All of You read the posts once or twice before posting if there are not some typos because of fast writing ?

G4Soon
07-27-2001, 06:57 PM
glGirl: That's a very good point. Also, I like how your name would be a method and not a constant...

VladR: Definately... this is the only place I can come to talk about programming with other interested individuals. Also, I can see how others would think that staying up until 1:00 or 2:00 in the morning "typing some heiroglyphs" is a waste of time, but they (non-programmers) rarely understand us coders. that bugs me.

Michael Steinberg
07-28-2001, 08:13 AM
For my mom it doesn't make any difference wether I'm sitting there programming or playing games. It's both wasted time.